He had asked to meet with me to discuss a matter of “great importance,” as he put it in our brief phone conversation. “So, what is going on?” I asked. I had known both him and his wife socially for a few years now albeit we had never taken our friendship into the sexual realm.
“I’m not sure, it all started about six months ago when we came back from spending a week at one of the Caribbean resorts. I noticed that during our vacation at the resort she didn’t seem interested in following up on the contacts we made, a couple of times she told me to go ‘play' by myself, which, as you know, the chances of that happening are close to zero…and after we came back she didn’t seem interested in going to parties or meeting other couples…she said that maybe we could have an open marriage, see other people on our own…not sure what’s going on…would you mind speaking with her? Maybe you can find out what’s going on with her…she trusts you and respects your knowledge in these matters… she may tell you”.
I agreed. I liked his wife, she was a pretty and attractive brunette, about 5 foot 2”, late forties, with a beautiful, spontaneous smile, I would say she was somewhat shy but willing to engage in pleasant conversation if one was to make the first move. I called her and told her that her husband had suggested we meet, that he was concerned about the “open marriage” deal….she agreed to meet with me so that we could chat.
We met at quiet pub where I knew we could carry on a conversation without being interrupted.
“So, what’s going on? Bill tells me that you lost interest in swinging but want to see other people separately?”
“Ah, is that what he told you?”
“Yes, indeed,” I replied watching the look of amusement that all of a sudden came over her face.
“It isn’t quite that simple, you see, it isn’t that I have a problem with swinging per se, Bill always got something out of it, and so did I at times….but very few times…”
I knew that they had been swinging for the last five years or so, actually I had met them early in their swinging lifestyle and they always seemed to enjoy their swinging activities so I wondered why this sudden change of heart.
“Let me tell you what swinging means to me as a woman,” she said. “I like to dress sexy, even slutty, I like the feeling that I’m attractive and desired…I enjoy the attention I get, the flirting, the dancing, the seduction….oh yes, I need to be seduced, I need to have that emotional connection that comes from being seduced and seducing the other person, feeling that there is more to the interaction than just plain sex….
“That somehow the connection is deeper even if it’s just a temporal thing…”
“So, you want to feel desired and be seduced, how about the sex?”
With a smile she replied “You’re so ‘male' in your attitude….it isn’t just all about the sex.” The look of puzzlement must have made look somewhat silly because she grabbed my arm and squeezed it gently.
“Let me tell you how it goes for me. Sex is very important, but especially good, passionate sex. Bill and I have a good sex life but sometimes the passion is missing for varied reasons; time, kids, work, stress…albeit our sex life is anchored in a deep love for each other sometimes it becomes somewhat mechanical. At the beginning, swinging was a diversion from the ‘same old, same old' of our everyday lives, a chance to meet new and exciting people. I had expectations that through swinging I would find partners that would put back the passion so important to sex for me. I was quite sure that I could bring back my passionate experiences back to my sexual relationship with Bill. Right from the beginning I was looking for the ‘quality' of the passionate encounters, and not the quantity. Perhaps I was trying to recreate the feeling I had in high school when I went out on a date for the first time…it was all about the process of the date, sex may happen but it wasn’t guaranteed, although I’m sure the guys all expected…”
At this point she giggled and covered her mouth with her hand as thought trying to conceal the secret she just let out.
“What I found in swinging was quite different from what I expected. Since I’m not Bi I don’t look at swinging as an opportunity to have sex with other women: I like men….also, when we first started to go to ‘socials,' I enjoyed the dancing, the flirting, what I call the seduction game…but it soon became apparent to me that not that many men are into the ‘seduction' process, rather, they’re more concern with the fuck…often men would chit-chat and quickly they would start to touch in a intimate way, grabbing for the prize as it were without bothering with much else…I often would go along only because Bill was much into their wives or partners…but my sexual experience was, for the most part…ummmm… uninteresting and not exciting. I guess the ‘straw that broke the camel’s back' was an experience I had at the resort we visited recently. On the day we arrived, and after unpacking, we joined a group of people in the hot-tub by the pool; I went into the water and no sooner did I put my head back attempted to relax from the long trip, when I felt a hand come up my thigh and cup my pussy….when I opened my eyes there was this gentleman smiling at me while his fingers had found their way into my pussy…and he said ‘Hi, I’m Bob…and you’re a very hot woman…' I pushed my body away and smiled politely and told him I was rather tired and only interested in relaxing for now, but he was insistent, suggesting that we should retire to his room where he could massage my back and really help me relax. I told him I wasn’t interested and retired to our room. Now, you know you’ll say that not all men are that aggressive, that this may have been an exception more than the rule, but I would disagree with you. Most of the men I have met through swinging aren’t interested in the seduction, as though they don’t want to “work” for the sex but expect it as a matter of course. Many men just sit and watch the women play and join in at the end of the ‘female games.' Others sit around and do nothing until the action starts and they join in…and though you are now expected to ‘perform' as they ‘perform'….Finally, I’m fed up with the whole swinging thing…I would still like to enjoy a sexual encounter with a man f my choosing that doesn’t take me or the situation for granted, that is willing to dine me, take me dancing, seduce me, someone I can have passionate sex with…and then go home to Bill and tell him all about…do you think I’m crazy?”
“Nope, I think you have a very valid point with respect to the lacking of ‘seduction' in the protocol of many men in the swinging lifestyle….maybe we do expect the ‘fuck,' after all that is why everyone is into swinging, isn’t it? We meet, we greet, we fuck…..best way to prevent the emotional connection and the possibility of hurt feelings….or worse, the budding of a ‘relationship…'”
“So, it's the fear of the emotional connection that prevents men from becoming the seducers? That’s a poor excuse if you ask me…or do men think that seduction will lead to ‘love?' Ridiculous….to me seduction is about the lust, and I always thought that swinging was about lust….”
“Maybe, swingers are becoming complacent….I know I have witnessed situations very much like the ones you have described….almost as if the lust is forced or expected…” I replied. “But understanding that swingers aren’t an homogenous group and that swinging can take many forms, perhaps you have just been hanging out with the ‘wrong' crowds…”.
“Really” she retorted, “How about when you meet another couple on a first date? Do you know how much pressure is on the woman to carry through from the meet to the sex? Yes, at times there’s instant chemistry, but that is the exception more than the rule…and what if your partner and the other person’s partner hit it off and you don’t? The want…? There are always the excuses and the quick exits but why go through all of that? Nah! I’m fed up…”
“Well, let me know what you guys decided and how you propose to go about your open marriage. I think there could be more pitfalls in that type of scenario but….it’s your life, your decision. I’m always available for a chat if you need to…”
Now, it has been months since my conversation with Bill and his wife. Not sure how they’re doing, but at least I heard no news, which perhaps means there are no bad news. I see Bill three to four times a week at the health club, we chat, joke, but he hasn’t brought up the subject.
Meanwhile I have spoken with several women in the lifestyle about this issue since I was curious if there were other women that felt that there was a lack of “seduction” in swinging. Unfortunately, I have to say that I heard the same story several times from most of the women I spoke with.
I have just now started to research women’s expectations of swinging and I would welcome your commentary, suggestions, stories, and questions.
Are we, men, really missing the boat when it comes to women, swinging, and seduction?
17 Comments
Wow. I feel like most of that was right out of my own thoughts. Thanks for sharing this.
You're quite welcome. If you want to share a story drop me a line, confidentiality is assured.
This is a very interesting article. It's probably just me, but it seems like many stories I read about swinging and playing do not usually discuss the possible pitfalls and situations such as what happened in the above story. I am very much interested in any updates to this tale; I really do enjoy learning all I can.
Even as a non-swinging guy, I can relate to where the wife is coming from. What she seems to crave is the uncertainty in an encounter; the process of discovering more about the other person and developing a relationship from which to explore the possibilities of sex. She also seems to crave an emotional connection that is usually not present in chance encounters.
(As an aside, I do wonder if she should first work on rekindling the passion between herself and her husband. By her own admission, she finds the passion lacking, and this could explain her need for it outside of the relationship. I would recommend that she try to get as much as she can from her husband first, then look elsewhere for things that she cannot possibly obtain from him, such as "extra" passion, or seduction and flirtation with an entirely new person.)
In my humble opinion as a poly guy, relationships (even in swinging) aren't all about the sex. The journey itself should be a source of excitement and enjoyment, and skipping directly to the endgame results in extremely disappointing sex. For many guys, however, physical pleasure and achievement of the conquest is paramount. These individuals care little about the development and want to skip straight to what they consider "fun". It appears that the wife has, unfortunately, met many of these men in her lifestyle experiences.
The excuse that some guys use for not falling in love may be grounded in fact, but it is still a poor excuse. There are still some clubs and couples that discourage friendships between couples and enforce casual-sex-only, but these are dwindling in number as Cooper and friends make inroads. As many swingers are discovering, the joy of having a long-term friendship to fall back on after the spark of passion has faded often trumps a casual sex romp with no callbacks (not that there's anything wrong with the latter, at least in moderation—spontaneity, like friendship, is a spice of life). Perhaps in ten or twenty years we will see a paradigm shift in the lifestyle that will satisfy the wife in this article.
In the meantime, however, it appears that an open marriage might indeed be a better fit for her. Although it does bring its share of challenges to the table, it gives her the possibility of developing relationships outside of her marriage that she can pursue at her leisure, rather than feeling forced to perform for either her husband or the gentleman in question. Sometimes feeling relaxed and comfortable can make all the difference in the world.
In any relationship, especially an open one, everyone involved should be getting exactly what they need or there is no reason to be in it. I applaud the wife mentioned in this article for developing an alternative to a lifestyle choice that didn't make sense for her.
This is a close approximation of our (my) dilemma. After a long time around the scene, I think I can see some reasons why the seduction part has been erased…
1. The husband simply does not have a license to really seduce another man's wife until his wife says so. Many guys report literally "waiting for the green light". Of course this is a feed-forward stupid process because then both men are waiting for each other's wife to do.
2. The husband may be reluctant because he knows that the woman he is flirting with is a lot more/less hot than his own wife. This is triply true when the woman is much hotter than his wife.
3. Let's be honest – swinging started out as wife-swapping and the men made all the decisions. Little has really changed – just look at the article about pressure and expectations on women versus the disappointing reality of men who just want to fuck.
I want to share fantasies with my partner. She is admittedly an attention whore and needs to be seduced by the men we might meet. Unfortunately she has been disappointed so often that she basically expects mediocrity. At this point it has become "go play by yourself", which is exactly NOT what I want (but unlike the friend in the article that would be something that could easily happen).
My guess is that the LS is not totally devoid of men who will bring their A-game and seduce a woman. Certainly I have had ZERO negativity on this point (although can also testify that focusing on the other woman has pissed off my partner a LOT because of course the other guy was a coat-tailer). The question is, how to find the quality men who will take the time to really stroke a woman's mind. I know how to do it and am utterly afraid of trying because that's how I did it long before we became a committed couple.
Mr….who is pretty frustrated in the men for being such dipshits…especially because it affects my girl and therefore us and me by extension.
I fully agree with what you say. Unless your wife is agreeable it is futile to try to seduce another man’s wife with the desireto fuck her. In our case it is the wife who told me that her girlfriends told her that she would like to “borrow” me for the weekend so we could fuck and have great sex. So we did have some threesomes with single women and we fucked while the wife watched or went to bed.
neal
Great post and wonderful to hear that other women, out there, feel the same way. I have always told my husband that my biggest erogenous is between my ears. This article highlights that fact and difference in what sex means to men and women. I’m not looking for any emotional attachment but I sure as hell want to have fun establishing a sexually charged mental connection before I hit the sheets!
wow…i could have written this…
Wow I just ran across your blog and it’s so great. It’s so real! My husband and I just started a blog and we have just started in the last couple years to dabble in different things and the lifestyle is intriguing to us. This blog is so refreshing.
Please if you have a moment come check out our blog.
We will definitely be back.
My husband and I have been in the lifestyle for about 3 years now, and I could not agree more with the woman in this article. I’m not sure if it is just that the men don’t want to work for it, or if it is that they are afraid that their wife will get angry with them for trying to seduce the other woman. Sadly, it has happened to us many times, even with very close friends. I’m to the point that I am ready to give up on the lifestyle. I wish my husband would allow an open relationship. At least the single males don’t have a problem with making the effort to seduce a woman.
This is so true. The ASSUMED-ness of the fucking is exhausting. The assumption that I will want to have sex with your wife because I’m a woman, too, is wrong and exhausting. I don’t necessarily need seduction, but I’m not a toy for your groping pleasure.
Definitely agree with this woman.
The thrill for me is “will I pull?” “will something happen?” …etc. I think that partially, it makes a person feel powerful and attractive, in a situation where someone isn’t expecting sex, as is the case in a swinging venue.
I have to agree with the wife in many regards. I am not a sure thing, I need to feel a physical attraction to the men I have sex, that feeling of excitement being with someone new and being a women this is in part achieved by engaging my brain. I do not pay much regard to his wife other then my partner needs to find her reasonably attractive enough to fuck. He really gets more excited seeing me pleasured then himself.
I am not bi either, so not being in the lifestyle to lick other women’s pussy’s I find it frustrating that on the profiles of swinger’s sites they hardly have any pictures of the male half. I am going to pick a couple by my attraction to her husband way more then by how she looks and I have the final say in who we pick to play with. If there is no pictures of the husband on the profile I just pass it by.
This article is pretty right on- men, please bring on your game, and make your partner feel secure and sexy while you do this- a turn on for all. Less wasted time and more play time=fun swinging and doing it together, which is what swinging is about…right?
The wife’s thoughts are right on. My wife says that she likes being seduced by the man she finds handsome and sexually attractive before she will consider playing with and then going to bed with him. Only under these circumstances she will consider opening up her thighs so he can sink his dick in her pussy and the two can then have intercourse and fuck to orgasm.
There are too many men in the Lifestyle who just want to swap mates and fuck the woman without giving any thought about first sedudcing the woman which is what makes the sexual intercourse between the two very rewarding.
From our experience in socializing with other vanilla (nonnswinger) couples, it seems that many women are interested in having sex with someone other than her hubby. Her actions and words seem to indicate that she is looking to be seduced so she can enjoy sexual intercourse with another woman’s husband. This poses a dilemma since most likely the woman’s hubby is not into swinging. And, if you two (husband/wife) are close friends with the other couple the conventional swingers’ wisdom tells us to avoid swapping mates with close friends and fucking each other’s mate. Does someone have an answer to this conundrum? I would love to seduce the woman and then the two of us can play and fuck each other for a satisfying orgasm, but we are not allowed to. So, the sexual intercourse between the two of us just remains an unsatisfied fantasy for the other wife amd me. Therein lies the rationale, perhaps, for an open marriage where women are free to enjoy sex with man/men of her choosing.
We would love to hear your thoughts.
neal
I agree. I love the seduction of the game. I love seducing him (and her as I am bi, but know better than to just assume that she is gonna wanna lick away at me) and I love being seduced. I also get a huge charge watching Trbl work his magic on the other wife. Watching him make her comfortable and then flirting with her till she opens up and eventually moving to teasing touches and whispered words and well timed kisses and nuzzles till she wants him as much as I do.
While wild spontaneous sex is ok from time to time the thrill of the chase makes the act of giving myself over to her / him so much more intense. It engages all parts of me and makes the experience much better. Add to that watching Trbl seduce the other wife and that makes for some amazing chemistry.
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